BACK AND FORTH

Should pot be legalized, or not? That was the question debated between
Steve Hager, editor-in-chief of High Times magazine, and Drug
Enforcement Administration veteran Robert Stutman in debate held
Wednesday night at the Jorgensen entitled "Heads versus Feds."

"I'm going to give you five reasons why marijuana should be
legalized," Hager said.

He continued to give his five points, beginning with the medical uses
marijuana has to offer.

"There are more diseases that [marijuana] can be used for than any
other substance," Hager said.

According to Hager, 157 million prescriptions are written a year to
patients, with the only reason being to make him or her feel better.
Hager described the criminalization of marijuana as a conspiracy
contrived by the pharmaceutical companies to increase profits.

According to Hager, prescription drugs are a synthetic, poor solution
to medical problems, as they not only can be provided to those with
insurance -- but have various dangerous side effects.

"One-hundred and fifty thousand people die from prescription drugs
each year." Hager said. "That's like a 747 going down every day."

Hager also said there are economical reasons to legalize marijuana, in
addition to the environmentally friendly use of hemp. According to
Hager, petro chemicals make up a majority of products used everyday
which can be substituted by hemp. Hager said that petro chemicals are
the leading cause of pollution.

Hager also criticized the modern day prison system.

"We built the biggest prison system," Hager said. "There are over two
million in jail, yet no rapist has to face a mandatory minimum
sentence, but someone growing pot will. Prison is not a solution, it's
a bigger problem down the road because they're all coming out sometime."

Hager's last two reasons were what he said was the corruption
revolving around the black market and his own personal beliefs.

"It's part of my culture. I've attended rainbow family gatherings with
20 to 30 thousand people on the fourth of July to get together and
pray," Hager said. "We are a good culture, and we could do a lot
better for this country if there weren't these laws."

Stutman rebuttled Hager's points;

"I guess Steve forgot to tell you that the single largest producer of
revenue is aspirin, which is natural," Stutman said.

Stutman said he agreed Hager's plan sounded great, but said Hager had
missed out on telling the audience the entire story.

"He did not mention that most want it legalized to use
recreationally," Stutman said. "If that's the premises, it will not be
passed in the United States."

According to Stutman, a substance is not necessarily beneficial just
because it is natural. Arsenic is a natural substance, yet it is
considered a poison. He also said if anyone were to vote on the issue
of legalizing marijuana, it should be scientists and doctors - not the
general public who would be using it for primarily recreational purposes.

"Any doctor who tells you to smoke something for your health is a
fool," Stutman said.

According to Stutman, European countries, where hemp is grown legally,
do not have a wide base use of hemp. Stutman said that European
nations do not have clothes made from hemp, or utilize hemp textiles
in vast amounts.

In dealing with the physical effects, Stutman said marijuana
deteriorates the brain, leaving the user with short-term memory loss,
lack of motivation and interfer with peoples' ability to think.

He quoted a Columbia University study saying that students with an
average grade of "D" were four times as likely to smoke marijuana than
the average "A" student. Stutman then said that users tend to grow a
dependence on the substance and more and more users are submitting
themselves to detox clinics.

Hager then intervened with a second round of rebuttals, beginning with
the common misconceptions of pot.

"If pot causes dependence, ban tobacco, ban alcohol, ban coffee, ban
sex," Hager said

Hager went on to describe the positive side effects of marijuana,
personally addressing Stutman and inviting him to give in and use
marijuana in Amsterdam.

"You'll eat great, you'll sleep great and you'll have the best sex of
your life," Hager said.

Katie Fleming, a 7th-semester psychology major, said she made sure she
came early to find a seat in the front row. She found the debate both
informative and entertaining.

"I think that there are a lot of points that everyone should be
informed about," Fleming said. "Especially the problem with certain
groups discrediting the movement."

The night began with a video presentation portraying the different
backgrounds and cultures of each debater. Stutman, described in the
video presentation as one of the most famous narcs in America, was one
of the first officers to work on the crack epidemic in Harlem.

On the other hand, Hager was introduced as a hometown boy who lost all
faith in Christianity after his parish priest told him that all Jews
and Buddhists were going to hell. According to the presentation, Hager
developed an interest in novels and enjoyed famous works from Ken
Kesey and Tom Wolfe. It was around this time that he created and
distributed his own publication called the "Tin Whistle." Later on,
Hager began a career as a reporter for the New York Daily News until
he landed a job as a writer for High Times. From there, Hager immersed
himself deeper into the counterculture and also the use of marijuana.