THE DEBATE OVER LEGALIZING MARIJUANA

Tavis Smiley, Guest Host

SMILEY: The president takes action and has some asking this -- is he
taking a turn to the right?

Plus, will Obama make history and push to make marijuana use legal?

Not if opponents can help it. Marijuana -- the debate with Montel
Williams, Stephen Baldwin and others next on LARRY KING LIVE.

Good evening.

I'm Tavis Smiley sitting in for Larry tonight.

SMILEY: President Obama yesterday, speak of the president, also, as
we all know by now, held an online town hall meeting yesterday. He
noted the Internet community had a high interest in having him answer
a question on legalizing marijuana to help the economy. So he addressed it.

Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When can we expect the jobs that have been
outsourced to other countries to come back and be made available to
the unemployed workers here in the United States?

OBAMA: Not all of these jobs are going to come back. And it probably
wouldn't be good for our economy for a bunch of these jobs to come
back, because, frankly, there's no --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SMILEY: That was during the town hall meeting, Gary, when he talked
about marijuana question. We didn't get to that in that particular
clip. I want to ask you about it, because we're going to debate this
later in the show with Stephen Baldwin and Montel Williams, your
stance though on whether or not the time is right to have a
conversation about legalizing?

(CROSS TALK)

SMILEY: I'm going to explain that later. What about the conversation?

SHANDLING: Isn't it a conversation that we don't want to legalize --
that the president -- don't legalize marijuana in order to stimulate
- -- it's not an economy stimulator?

SMILEY: It's not.

SHANDLING: I'll oppose it on the economic level, first, which is, as
far as I know, it's going to make the economy more sluggish, sit on
the couch and eat Doritos. It's pretty common sense. I think some of
this stuff is more common sense. I'm still not hearing answers. I
watch CNN a lot. I like to watch people talk about all these issues
that I'm sitting here now talking about, except I'm not pretending to
have the answers. I can't believe how freely people are willing to --

SMILEY: That's the point you made earlier, though, that we don't know
what the answer is, and that's OK. As long as we're trying to figure
out -- SHANDLING: So everyone's trying to jump on this and we're
trying to make it a story. And I know we're in trouble and I was
watching that flood, thinking, my god, it's close to biblical
prophesy. It feels like things are pretty dark, taking a bad turn.
And I'm thinking, what does it say in the Bible. How far does the
stock market have to go down before -- before Jesus comes back and
says, I warned you!

SMILEY: I've got 30 seconds, Arianna. Let me ask -- I've been anxious
to ask you this question specifically, whether or not a president can
be over-exposed. President Obama, whether it's Leno, whether it's
CNN, whether it's "Face the Nation," whether it's this town hall
meeting online -- can a president be over-exposed?

HUFFINGTON: Tavis, I think this is a non-issue. No, I don't think he
can be over-exposed. I think he should go on any television show, do
online chats, give press conference, all that is good. But I do want
to answer that question about our failed drug war, because it is a
very important criminal justice question. It's not a question about
our economy.

And with what's happening in Mexico, with what's happening on our
border there, this is clearly a moment, as senator Jim Webb said, to
rethink our failed drug war, which has been a war on minorities. And
I was hoping that the president would actually dare to take this on,
because it has become the third rail of American politics.

SMILEY: Let me thank Arianna Huffington, David Frum, and Gary
Shandling for a spirited conversation tonight about the issues of the week.

Is the debate over medical marijuana almost over or just getting
started? On this show, just getting started. More on it in a moment
on LARRY KING LIVE after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Federal agents with guns raided Lynch's business and home.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Seconds later, Charles heard banging at his front door.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They said, search warrant! Open up! Search warrant!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Deputies carried boxes of evidence out of the
dispensary around 2:30 this afternoon.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Federal authorities seized 30 pounds of marijuana.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SMILEY: Marijuana was in the news this week, big-time. And Charlie
Lynch was in the thick of it. He's emerged as a key figure in the
national debate over medical marijuana. Charlie was convicted on
federal charges in connection with his operation of a medical
marijuana dispensary. His sentencing this week was postponed. Charlie
Lynch and his attorneys, Reuven Cohen and John Littrell, are with us
tonight to tell us about what happened, or what didn't happen this
week, why it was postponed, and what it all means.

Glad to have you gentleman here. Charlie, let me start with you. What
were you expecting to happen this week that obviously got postponed.

CHARLIE LYNCH, CONVICTED FOR DISPENSING MARIJUANA: I thought I was
going to be sentenced to jail time, probably in the area of five
years or more. And when the judge decided he wanted more information
about the new policy, everybody's really surprised by his decision to
find out more information about the new policy.

SMILEY: Ruben, from a legal standpoint, what happened this week?

REUVEN COHEN, LYNCH'S ATTORNEY: What happened was that Judge Wu asked
for the local prosecutors to go back to main justice in D.C. and get
some sort of clarification on what Attorney General Holder has been
saying over the course of the past three, four weeks. It's a matter
of some debate. What we've been hearing from the attorney general is
that somehow now, in order to be prosecuted under the Holder
administration -- the Obama administration, you need to have both
violated federal and state law, which is a sea change, a landmark
change from what has really been the status quo under the Bush administration.

SMILEY: Of a zero tolerance policy.

COHEN: Of a zero tolerance policy. At our trial, the federal
government, after millions of dollars, was able to prove that Charlie
was dispensing marijuana from his marijuana dispensary. He had done
that in complete compliance with state law. He had the mayor on his
side. He had the local police department often coming in for coffee,
the city attorneys.

What the government does in all of these cases, or used to do, and
now I think won't do anymore, is move to keep people like Charlie and
lawyers like us from talking about compliance with state law. They
used to try really hard. And they tried quite hard in our case to
keep us from bringing that to the forefront, because no jury really
wants to convict someone like Charlie Lynch for doing what is legal
here in California.

SMILEY: But what does this mean, though, John, for the conversation
that we have been having in America for some time now about medical
marijuana? This change from the Obama administration -- from the Bush
administration, rather, to the Obama administration, which, again,
your colleague seems to suggest may change how they prosecute or
don't prosecute these cases. What does this postponement mean for
medical marijuana and the conversation about it in this country?

JOHN LITTRELL, LYNCH'S ATTORNEY: Well, we're going to find out, in
terms of what it means for Charlie Lynch. But I think this is a
change that everyone has seen coming for a long time. I think that
politicians are coming to their senses. I think that, with this
administration, we're going to start to see some practical approaches
to medical marijuana. I think what that's ultimately going to mean is
legalizing it, making it available to patients who need it. I think
that the administration is not going to be interested anymore in
directing resources to prosecuting people like Charlie Lynch, when we
have real, harmful drugs and the violence associated with that order.

SMILEY: Charlie, obviously the case got postponed this week. Give me
your sense now of how you feel about medical marijuana, your role in
it. Do you feel apologetic? Would you still do it if you could? Give
me a sense of how you feel?

LYNCH: I kind of feel like the federal government has been waging a
civil war against the people of the state of California. And I'm
hoping that the Obama administration is going to end that civil war
and stop the prosecution, stop the raids, pull our brothers and
sisters out of prison, and also not send me as a prisoner of this war to jail.

SMILEY: If you end up not having to go to jail, and you, through
whatever means -- this case, rather, gets kicked out, you ready to go
back into business again? You look forward to doing that again? Have
you learned something from this that you don't want to do this anymore?

LYNCH: I felt like I was abiding by the California state laws. And if
I was able to reopen the dispensary with the blessing of the city,
like I had before, and I knew the federal government was not going to
interfere with our constitutional and god-given rights, I would
definitely seriously consider opening a dispensary again. But I've
got this other challenge ahead of me, you know, a jail thing still.

SMILEY: That's an understatement. I'm glad to have you on. Charlie,
Reuven and John, thanks for coming on the program.

I should mention, before we go to break, this program, LARRY KING
LIVE, reached out to the U.S. Attorney's Office, Mr. Holder, for a
comment on Mr. Lynch's situation. A spokesperson declined, citing
Justice Department's policy of not commenting on pending cases.

We've got more here. We'll check back on the situation in Fargo in 60
seconds. And then, don't forget, Stephen Baldwin and Montel Williams
go at it about marijuana use. Don't go away.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWS BREAK)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(NEWS BREAK)

SMILEY: The debate over medical marijuana is an emotional one. With
us tonight, representing the pro-side of this conversation, Montel
Williams, host of "Montel Across America," debuting April 6th on Air
America. He has, as many of us know, MS, and has very strong feelings
about those in pain being allowed to access and use the drug. He
wrote the book "Living Well Emotionally."

Stephen Baldwin, on the other side, so to speak, is an actor, talk
radio host, and author. He opposes the legalization of marijuana.
Montel, Stephen, glad to have you both on the program.

(CROSS TALK)

SMILEY: Montel, let me start with you. Very simply and very directly, why?

MONTEL WILLIAMS, TALK SHOW HOST: You know, I want to make sure that
we get this characterized exactly right. I have never been a
proponent of legalizing marijuana. I have been a proponent of making
sure that a doctor who is trained and a specialist who understands
how to prescribe medication, if that doctor chooses to prescribe
medication for his patient, and that patient happens to be me, and he
can put me on a morphine drip and he also says, I also recommend this
medication, then he should be able to do so. And the state should
allow him to prescribe this, and I should be able to get it.

But here's what's so odd about this, we talk about this topic, we
don't ever talk about it from a place of truth. We always start with
a lot of rumors and falsehoods. But the truth is, on May 10th of this
year, the federal government celebrated the 30th anniversary of a
program, Tavis, that was started under the first Bush administration,
where the United States government has been dispensing marijuana
every single month for 30 years to 25 people across the United
States. Unfortunately, in the last five to six years, it's now down
to five people because the other people have passed away.

Our government grows it. It certifies it. It puts a USDA stamp on it.
And every single month, our government sends that medication out to
five people across the United States. You can check this yourself. As
a matter of fact, it was called the Compassionate Investigational New
Drug Program. It started 30 years ago May 10th. Every single month,
through a program at the University of Mississippi, we the federal
government and your taxpayer dollars goes to a program to grow
marijuana and dispense it.

Our country dispenses marijuana to patients who are ill. But,
unfortunately, that program got cut off to just now five people. I
ask you this question and I ask this of Stephen: I'm not trying to
legalize marijuana, I'm just trying to say, here's a government
that's supposed to do no harm, a government that's supposed to be
compassionate to all its citizens; what right does this government
have to say that we're going to give medication to five people and
let them be pain free, and for all the rest of you, you go to hell,
we're not going to help you, the program's closed? That's not
appropriate in America today. SMILEY: I got a break in 30 seconds. I
don't want to cut you off. I'll come right to you and let you respond
to the question that Montel Williams poses. We'll take a break. I
don't want to cut you off. We'll take a break and come back and I'll
come right to you and let you respond to the question that Montel
Williams' poses. Montel, thanks or doing my job on LARRY KING LIVE.
We'll take a break and hear Stephen Baldwin's response in just a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SMILEY: It's the marijuana debate, featuring Montel Williams and
Stephen Baldwin. We heard Montel's point of view before the break.
Mr. Baldwin, the floor or the microphone is yours, sir.

STEPHEN BALDWIN, ACTOR: Thank you very much, Tavis. It's great to be
here. First of all, this isn't even a debate between Montel and I. We
got crazy love for one another. I have a lot of respect for him as well.

I can't speak for the government, Montel, but I do want to say this:
it's obvious, America wants its marijuana. This is a fascinating
topic now. But my question is, how do we control it? Obviously,
there's a movement that's coming. It's beyond just the legalization
of it medically, Montel. And that's the problem that I have.

Let me finish -- please, like Jack Cafferty said earlier on this
network, he's sober 20 years and he doesn't want his kids to do what
he did, which is what all kids do, drink and smoke a joint. You have
to understand, alcohol in this country can only profit the government
in taxation, a maximum annually of 25 billion a year. But the
negative cause and effect is over 150 billion. How are we going to
prevent that if this ball starts rolling.

WILLIAMS: Stephen, I will agree with you on all those premises. I've
got to tell you something, your tax dollars have paid for 30 years
for the United States government to dispense this drug through
pharmacies around the country. They're already doing it. It's not
like we have to invent something new. It's been done and controlled.
No one's stolen one can in 30 years.

BALDWIN: I don't know about all that.

WILLIAMS: Also, 13 states in this country right now -- the state of
California has medicinal marijuana centers across the state, where
they have -- they give them licenses and they license people to do
it. Here's part of the problem, Tavis, I've got to tell you. All you
have to do is ask some smart people. And I believe I'm one of them. I
will go down and show you how we can open up dispensaries, how the
government can control this and contain it, because, look, I don't
want it in the hands of my children either. Stephen, you just said it yourself.

Look, if my daughter and your daughter are laying on gurney in a
hospital right now and they're both ill, they're both hurting. And
the federal government walks in and says Montel, here, your child can
take this to feel better, I'm sorry, Stephen, the heck with your
daughter, you would revolt. America should revolt now.

SMILEY: Montel, it seems to me -- I'm not arguing a point, I'm just
asking a question. It seems to me that if you take the government out
of it -- and so many of us believe the government is too involved in
our lives, in too many respects and aspects in the first place -- why
control it request when government can just legalize it. Or put it
another way, why not just decriminalize it?

WILLIAMS: Here's the thing, there are people smarter minds than me
that know the answer how we continue it even if we make it a
commercial industry. I'm not against that. If that's what's going to
help a doctor give me medication, I'm sorry, I've got to beg for
things that make my life better. The bottom line is, right this
minute, we have a two-tiered system for 30 years.

It's not like this was yesterday. Ladies and gentlemen, you need to
listen up and do the research yourself. For 30 years, our government
sends out marijuana. Is this not an egregious offense, the same
government that locks up a child or someone with a joint in their
pocket, is actually a drug dealer. They are dispensing it every single month.

SMILEY: What about that distinction between legalizing and
decriminalizing? What about the latter?

BALDWIN: I disagree with the latter as well. You're talking to a guy
20 years sober, Tavis, off of drugs and alcohol. I know the affects
of marijuana firsthand. I can tell you right now, if this starts to
become something that is more readily available to our youth, the
ramifications and repercussions of that in the next 30 years will be
beyond our comprehension.

SMILEY: Do you buy the argument that marijuana leads to harder stuff?

BALDWIN: That's a fact.

(CROSS TALK)

BALDWIN: Last time I was on the show with Ron Paul, you wouldn't
believe the e-mails I got, people are going to kill me, shoot me, all
kinds of stuff. America wants it's marijuana, man, I get it. But I am
just worried -- I am more concerned for the future and the youth of
America. And this drug, which is a very dangerous drug -- it's not a
casual thing. It's very dangerous -- is negatively effecting our youth.

MONTEL: Steve, let me just say, 30 seconds, right now, London,
Canada, there's a product that's on the marketplace in London right
now. It's called Sabotex (ph). It's made from marijuana. We have
outlawed even the research around marijuana in America, unless the
federal government themselves does it.

Here's the problem, right now, why don't we have an honest discussion
about this? If we need to take the government out of it, do so. We
could approach the pharmaceutical industry. There's money being made
overseas with products that are derivatives of marijuana. What I'm
trying to say to you, please, don't throw out the baby with the bath
water. There are some of us who need the medication and we should
have a right to it.

BALDWIN: Maybe you and I should get together and create some kind of
conference about this.

WILLIAMS: I am ready. Not only am I ready for a conference, I can
show you how to do it.

SMILEY: I'll show up and moderate it, how about that.

BALDWIN: Do it.

WILLIAMS: Love it, Tavis. Thank you.

SMILEY: Steven, nice to have you on. Stephen Baldwin. Montel
Williams, nice to have you on as well.

WILLIAMS: Good to see you, Stephen, my friend.

BALDWIN: God bless.

SMILEY: Larry King back in his chair, as he should be, on Monday
night. Larry, thanks for letting me sit in tonight. CNN continues
it's coverage of the drug violence in Mexico. Time now for Anderson
Cooper, on the border tonight with "AC 360" on the war next door.