Vandalism
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» cactain_steef replied on Sat Jan 31, 2004 @ 11:48pm |
 Coolness: 155390 | aw yeah! the river... made me do it. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» lakester replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:39am |
 Coolness: 60395 | Originally posted by AZZIZZUZZ...
if they dont clean the metros and etc...then there is gonna be more and more shit tagged..and its gonna be really ugly.. u need some cleaning..i dont know how much they invest in the cleaning..but id also be down to see some of that money used for the services.. but still need cleaning..dont wanna see crappy tags everywhere.. there's a limit to how many tags you can fit on a wall. after a wall, you run out of space. if the wall gets buffed (cleaned), it's only going to get tagged all over again. it's a vicious cycle. a can of paint only costs $2-$4. to clean a wall costs several thousand dollars. you tell me who has more to lose. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» greatjob replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:41am |
 Coolness: 283170 | I think you should all put a sock in your mugs.
Except for my boy Lake! WoRd uP! Torturing You Cats TyC 2004. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» lakester replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:45am |
| Coolness: 60395 | Originally posted by RATT BASTARD...
I think you should all put a sock in your mugs. Except for my boy Lake! WoRd uP! Torturing You Cats TyC 2004. Torturing Your Cats. Torturing Your Chicks. Torturing Your Children. I love it :) I still love Twisted Young Criminalz and Terrorist Youth Crew/Clan though. Man, I can't remember the last time I picked up a can of paint. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» greatjob replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:50am |
| Coolness: 283170 | Two Yappy Chicks, Tooting Your Chronik, Toothless Yokel Cletus....the list goes on... |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:51am |
 Coolness: 340380 | Originally posted by LAKESTER...
Graffiti is a lose-lose situation. Even if you somehow convince me, or Eldee or Mico to stop, 10 others will take our place. The government, STM, etc spend millions of dollars a year cleaning it up. Why? Because people like you whine about it. And what happens when they clean it up? We're given a blank slate to bust another tag or throw on. It's an endless cycle. We vandalize, you clean, we vandalize, etc. We're not going to stop. Vandals have been around before government and society were around. wow, i so wanna smack you for having that kind of mentality. "if i didn't do it, someone else would have.." let's change the situation a bit.. "If i hadn't stolen that guys card, someone else would have." Why do you have to be the lowest denominator? why can't you be better than that? No one, and i mean no one wants to see your name writen with a fat marker on a bus, metro or anywhere.. why? cause they don't give two shits about you wanting to be known.. it's this kind of "HEY LOOK AT ME! I WANT ATTENTION!" in your face crap that makes me dislike tagging. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» greatjob replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:51am |
| Coolness: 283170 | Smack him! I fucking DARE you pussyclot! |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Oliver_TwisteD replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 2:08am |
 Coolness: 86400 | it's true though, people have been writing thier names in strange places since cavemen were around. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 2:27am |
| Coolness: 340380 | writing names in caves....
really now, there's no freakin relation. at all. and as for wasting money on cleaning it up? Ponder this for just a quick second.. LETS SAY.. that tagging public property suddenly becomes legal.. what do you think would happen? A) Taggers would have a fun fest and tag the shit out of EVERYTHING, writing their name 75 times in a row down a wall, just so they could say "hey look, there's my name, 75 times! COOL!".. then the walls get messier and messier with this shit that no one but taggers want to see.. why? cause 95% of the public, DOES NOT WANT TO SEE THAT SHIT. THEN! once the entire city has been nailed with it.. suddenly montreal isn't such a great place for tourists.. no tourists, less business.. less business, more job loss, more job loss, MORE PEOPLE ON THE STREET. don't believe it would happen? think again. now for another possibility.. B)Businesses find new locations to advertise.. HEY! COOL! (says mcdonalds).. WE CAN ADVERTISE EEEEEEEEEEEEVERYWHERE!! NO LAWS!! the next day, ads for Big Macs are in every possible imaginable place... and i mean everywhere.. and it's not just mcdonalds doing it.. it's every business who wants to advertise.. and why the hell not? it's free, they can write anything they want anywhere.. public property is infact all around us.. next thing you know, when you wanna take a stroll through the park, instead of seing a nice forest or what have you, you've got a barrage of signs and posters destroying what was once nice.. While these are both extremes, they are both VERY plausible. It hasn't happened nor will it ever happen, which is why i'm very happy that we have laws against tags everywhere, and why the stuff gets cleaned up. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Oliver_TwisteD replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 2:37am |
| Coolness: 86400 | *makes the "home-alone" face*
:x |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» lakester replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 2:43am |
| Coolness: 60395 | Originally posted by DJNFRM...
Originally posted by lakester...
Graffiti is a lose-lose situation. Even if you somehow convince me, or Eldee or Mico to stop, 10 others will take our place. The government, STM, etc spend millions of dollars a year cleaning it up. Why? Because people like you whine about it. And what happens when they clean it up? We're given a blank slate to bust another tag or throw on. It's an endless cycle. We vandalize, you clean, we vandalize, etc. We're not going to stop. Vandals have been around before government and society were around. wow, i so wanna smack you for having that kind of mentality. "if i didn't do it, someone else would have.." let's change the situation a bit.. "If i hadn't stolen that guys card, someone else would have." Why do you have to be the lowest denominator? why can't you be better than that? No one, and i mean no one wants to see your name writen with a fat marker on a bus, metro or anywhere.. why? cause they don't give two shits about you wanting to be known.. it's this kind of "HEY LOOK AT ME! I WANT ATTENTION!" in your face crap that makes me dislike tagging. dude, you're twisting my words. i'm not justifying my actions by saying 'if i don't do it, someone else will'. i'm not trying to justify my actions whatsoever. they're not justifiable to most people except other vandals. my point is that your words are falling on deaf ears. even if you make me repent my sins, there are still thousands of others like me who will continue to tag. i'm going to assume you use drugs and i'll use you as an example. i don't do drugs. never have. probably never will. i don't understand why someone would. you can't make me understand why you do. you cannot justify your actions to me. i think you're dumb for doing drugs, but i won't preach my values and beliefs on you. i used to be like that. i used to have heated arguments with friends when i found out they used drugs. i eventually realized it was a pointless argument. they can't get me to understand why they use drugs and i can't get them to stop. keep in mind that the government probably spends more money fighting drugs and drug related crimes in a week then it spends on fighting graffiti in a year. yet you'll continue to use drugs. if you don't use drugs, you can still see how the argument applies to someone else. or maybe you pirate software? download mp3s? are you going to tell me you don't commit crimes? wouldn't that make you the lowest common denominator as well? why can't you be better than that? |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 2:56am |
| Coolness: 340380 | Originally posted by LAKESTER...
dude, you're twisting my words. i'm not justifying my actions by saying 'if i don't do it, someone else will'. i'm not trying to justify my actions whatsoever. they're not justifiable to most people except other vandals. my point is that your words are falling on deaf ears. even if you make me repent my sins, there are still thousands of others like me who will continue to tag. So why not remove yourself from it? one less person means 50 less tags for them to remove from the wall, maybe saving a worker 2 hours of removal.. saving the gov $40.. and don't say that's nothing, cause it is.. i had $70 cut from my last paycheck, i would love to have that money back, but the gov took it to spend on things, things like paying that guy to remove tags you put up.. As for the drug deal, I don't do drugs.. but thats besides the point; drugs affect the user and only the user. not the general public, you wanna shoot up, go right ahead, people can do whatever they want with their lives it wont bother me.. untill it does. if someone who does drugs tries to get me to do drugs, i will suddenly have a problem with that person. same goes for them soliciting their drugs to others.. which is why... (public) solicitiation is a crime.. (well, different kind, but the general idea is there) Originally posted by LAKESTER...
or maybe you pirate software? download mp3s? are you going to tell me you don't commit crimes? wouldn't that make you the lowest common denominator as well? why can't you be better than that? Pirating software is done not by choice, if i had the money, i would infact buy the software. Photoshop goes for almost $1000.. When it comes to pirating music.. well, this is a completely other topic.. and if you wanna see my stance on it.. go check out: [ www.rave.ca ] I've been arguing pirated music there.. Copyright infringement hurts the individuals i'm infringing on, by not giving them money when they feel it's owed, even though they lose nothing.. anyway.. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» lakester replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 3:10am |
| Coolness: 60395 | talk about hypocrisy. you can't justify pirating software and fight against music piracy at the same time. adobe feels they're owed money for the software just as much as any music artist feels they're owed for their music.
you say pirating software isn't done by choice. so you're forced to pirate software? no one forces you to use photoshop. you chose to use it. (on a somewhat related note, have you looked into education deals? i know macromedia gives amazing discounts to students) as for drug use not affecting you? if i were to smoke a joint, it would harm you just as much as if i were to tag a mailbox. i can argue for hours on end about the potential harm drug users can cause to society, but that's a whole other story. but keep in mind what i said earlier. more money is spent fighting drug use and drug related crimes than fighting/cleaning vandalism. why don't i stop graffiti? because i enjoy it. for the same reasons a pothead doesn't stop smoking pot or pirate doesn't stop downloading music. for the record, i don't actively tag. i can't remember the last time i vandalized something. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 11:25am |
| Coolness: 340380 | Originally posted by LAKESTER...
talk about hypocrisy. you can't justify pirating software and fight against music piracy at the same time. adobe feels they're owed money for the software just as much as any music artist feels they're owed for their music. you say pirating software isn't done by choice. so you're forced to pirate software? no one forces you to use photoshop. you chose to use it. (on a somewhat related note, have you looked into education deals? i know macromedia gives amazing discounts to students) as for drug use not affecting you? if i were to smoke a joint, it would harm you just as much as if i were to tag a mailbox. i can argue for hours on end about the potential harm drug users can cause to society, but that's a whole other story. but keep in mind what i said earlier. more money is spent fighting drug use and drug related crimes than fighting/cleaning vandalism. why don't i stop graffiti? because i enjoy it. for the same reasons a pothead doesn't stop smoking pot or pirate doesn't stop downloading music. for the record, i don't actively tag. i can't remember the last time i vandalized something. i do not see any hypocrisy here at all, vandalism and copyright infringemtn are both crimes yes, but are completely different crimes. If the police saw you tagging they'd arrest you, if a copy saw me downloading photoshop, they would inform adobe, and adobe would sue me. Big difference here. If you were to tag adobe's building, they wouldn't need to sue, they could just press charges. as for this: "as for drug use not affecting you? if i were to smoke a joint, it would harm you just as much as if i were to tag a mailbox. " I'm sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense. like, zero. Drugs affect the user. Not society, unless you count him/her having to get health care later in life from drug abuse, but then i'd get into my argument that drug users shouldn't be allowed health care.. but that's also a different argument, we're talking about vandalism. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» Oliver_TwisteD replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 12:53pm |
| Coolness: 86400 | i think it depends on the form of graffiti. i'm not a big fan of tags. i think that writing your name in funny places is kind of lame unless that place was really hard to get to, then it's just funny.
but when it comes to well done graffiti, with lots of colour, style or a good message/ trippy design, i support it 100% |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» lakester replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:02pm |
| Coolness: 60395 | the hypocrisy i referred to is that you condone pirating software yet you're against pirating music.
as for my other argument, prove to me that me tagging a mailbox harms you more than me smoking a joint. as for the effect drug users have on society, there's an effect, like it or not. like i said that's a whole other argument. but to back up my point, my dad is a former drug user and it fucked up my family all kinds. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» neoform replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:05pm |
| Coolness: 340380 | ok, you're totally not getting me here..
i am against: -tagging in public places that are owned by the city (and are not designated for tagging) or private individuals (that do not want it) i *not* against: -music/software piracy. -certain well done graffiti's in the right places. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» eLDee replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 1:58pm |
 Coolness: 121630 | Lakestah has a point there
If I were to stop doing what I do there's gonna be at least 10 new guys trying to replace me and to tell you the truth, I'd rather see 70 of my burners on the wall than 700 wack ass tags around the place. And when you said "nobody cares about your stupid little tags" think again. Graffiti isn't something you want the public to judge you on.. hell some people don't even notice them, graffiti is by us for us kinda thing. It's a community thing that has deep roots in the hiphop culture, and unless you know anything about hiphop and how graffiti started and evolved it's pointless to continue this discussion. |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» G__ replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 2:27pm |
 Coolness: 142080 | i wanted to get back into this, but i really don't feel like it anymore |
| Good [+1]Toggle ReplyLink» greatjob replied on Sun Feb 1, 2004 @ 2:31pm |
| Coolness: 283170 | lol!
Only because Neofruit dominated the shit and made it realllly boring. |
Vandalism
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